French Language

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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

Chancer, an adverb is a word that describes an action, (verb) as in "I walked slowly home" - the adverb is "slowly" because it describes the way I
 walked (verb).

Many words are recognisable as adverbs because they end in "ly", like strangely, softly, urgently etc. In French some adverbs are recognisable beacuse they end in "ment" such as  lentement, recemment, gentillement.
Bien is an adverb: In "Il va bien", bien is an adverb that describes the verb va in that sentence. In " Vous dansez bien", the adverb bien describes the action danse.

A conjunction is a word that joins two parts of a sentence: "I went to the door and looked through the letter-box." The conjunction is "and" because it joins the two actions in one sentence.
Conjunctions are joining words such as  and, but because, then, nevertheless, (neanmoins), however, although.

I hope this helps a bit, but I apologise if I have only confused you. Maybe others have their own little tricks for remembering what part of speech does what. I'd be interested in hearing them.    

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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

Thinking back to those English grammar lessons - oh so far away now...  I do remember a few rules:
"A noun is the name of a person, place or thing."
"A verb is a word of doing or being."

And a little rhyme about adverbs:
"How, when and where, the adverbs tell.
As: quickly, slowly, here, now, well."

I suppose we had rhymes for other parts of speech, too, but can't remember any more.
(Oooh, good old Google!  Just for you, Chancer, here's the whole rhyme !)

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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

I hadn't heard that one before, Angela. We just learned bald statements: A noun is the name of any person, place, animal or thing. A verb is a doing word. A pronoun takes the place of a noun. An adjective is a word that describes a noun.
An adverb modifies (describes) a verb. Those are the ones I remember.
Now in primary schools conjunctions go by the name of connectives. (Just thought I'd throw that in.) Smile [:)]

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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

We were taught that not only did adverbs modify verbs they could also modify adjectives and other adverbs.

He ran quickly  - modifying the verb ran

He was a really fast runner

He ran really quickly

Hope this helps, Idun


"There are some causes worth dying for - there are no causes worth killing for" Albert Camus
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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

Well, I was trying not to confuse Chancer so I deliberately only gave examples of adverbs of manner to give him a flavour of their role in a sentence.  Of course there are also adverbial phrases and adverbial clauses.

Hey, do you think I should get out some of my old grammar books (of which I have some really serious ones) and do some revision myself? 

Edit:  someone sent me an email today, je vous remercie vivement de ......Never having come across this adverb before, I had to look it up to be sure.  Also another email said the person will send the stuff I have bought prochainement which was also new to me and now I love it so much I say it all the time!Big Smile [:D]

Apprendre une langue, c'est faire un voyage différent chaque jour.
from Fle pour les curieux
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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

The downside is that if like me you think more and more in French you may say something ridiculous like soonly in English, I dont think I have said that but some equally weird things, those occasions do show up differences between the French I know and the English in general.

If I said soonly I might get a strange look, maybe even the mickey taken which is good because at least then I know, the French are more likely to say "comment!" or "hein!" or turn to their wife and say "qu'est ce qu'il a dit?" or in many cases just not follow anything that I have said because of one incorrect or mispronounced word.

To be fair people especially friends do get "the ear" for my vache espagnole but the majority cant be bothered hence dont become friends,  I often wonder can I really be the only person that they have met or heard that speaks their langauge differently to them? Would they even  be able to mimic another nationality speaking French like most of us could in english?

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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

I, too, was thinking, Chance, that you don't need to know English grammar so much now and I didn't want to confuse you.  As you mostly speak French and as you can already speak English, it's really academic whether you need to know English grammatical terms.

I know lots of people who can speak  English very well and fluently (first language for some but not others) without ever having had an English grammar lesson in their lives.

I myself never gave a thought to grammar (although it was taught at school) until I had to do it with my TEFL course.  Sailed through various types of professional exams and a degree course with very little knowledge of grammar.  It's just something that you pick up along the way and either it grabs you and interests you or it doesn't.

I am known at all the French classes I have attended (in the 2 different places I have lived) that I HATE grammar lessons.  All the teachers console me and tell me it's necessaire but I still do not like it and cannot think of anything more boring than grammar lessons.  Give me a book to read, better still, read it with me and tell me the things about it that only a French person can (the cultural side) and I am as happy as Larry.

Just don't give me something that says, par exemple, les relatifs:  qui, que, où or anything to do with les pronoms.....ughCry Out [:'(]

Apprendre une langue, c'est faire un voyage différent chaque jour.
from Fle pour les curieux
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Re: néanmoins: can someone please

As much as I dont like it I realise it is very necessary, having a knowledge of English grammar would help me to understand French grammar and sentence construction, because its taught in a formal structured way not knowing the basics in English holds me back, its like teaching someone say car words in French and saying the word for windscreen is pare brise except the student is Polish and doesnt speak English. I think my real yearning to understand it is to teach English one day.

I did an intensive immersion course in Spanish, we did very little grammar etc and learnt like children, we did do conjugation and some tenses though.

Then initially in France I did a 2 week intensive course with a newly qualified (native speaker) French teacher, she had the latest and most up to date (for france anyway) teaching methods and we did very little grammar but lots and lots of work on conjugaison of the basic tenses, present, passé composé, imparfait, futur, conditionell IIRC. We never got involved with the compound tenses, active/passive voice, subjonctifs etc, it was really all about communication and was excellent.

Then it took me nearly 18 months to find a French teacher around here despite me being very persistant and driven (gives you some idea of what its like), she was much more formal and I got I suppose the education that most French kids do (she teaches English and French at une lycée professionelle)  I found it a hard slog and not as rewarding as with the first teacher but then learning follows the law of diminishing returns. What I didnt realise then was just how valuable the hard graft was going to prove to be.

We only had 18 months of lessons together and that was 5 years ago but I have made the greatest strides during that time by being able to apply the theory that I learnt to what I read and hear.

Without the slog at the very least I would not be able to write letters like I do with only the 5 basic tenses, I know a guy who has been out here for years, speaks very good French, is confidant and articulate, he is regional sales manager for a French company but when I hear him give a presentation I hear errors and  I realise that he is restricted in what tenses he can use, he is however supremely competent with what he does have, his real weakness is that he cannot write a business letter, he composes them in English and his wife translates them.

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