Finding/Owning French Property

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Re: This is one for ablf

Huge bias using examples that prove nothing. A main difference between the French and British systems is that the the French preempt problems and use preventative medicine while in most cases the British wait until the problem shows and deals with it as soon as possible afterwards. The economics of the two systems cannot be compared by a lay person with only few details at their disposal. Different philosophies and I know which one I prefer now, even if it did take a bit of getting used to. A bit like my local brico closing at lunchtime, an excuse to moan but actually not really a bad thing at all. Different not wrong.
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Re: This is one for ablf

I think betty is quite correct.

The health system in France is run as a business. I personally don't have much confidence in it to the point that I avoid going to doctors as much as I can. Whilst I can get a doctors appointment the same day / next day I wait to the problem is serious enough to warrant an appointment. Most people will go when they don't really need to just because the service is available. Is that waste ?

The emergency services and emergency care is superb mind you. Outside that, then it is a lottery depending on the doctor or specialist that you see. Some are great and some are useless. I have to admit, our rural doctor was brilliant. I do think rural doctors are better than city doctors.

Doctors do unnecessarily prescribe things. They always tend to refer you to a specialist (except rural doctors) rather than tackle the problem themselves. Then you wait weeks or months for the appointment and then nothing gets solved.

Eye care is a disaster in France outside of Paris.

So I think if the UK got on top of emergency care and social care they would have a much better system.
ner ner nee ner ner!!
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Re: This is one for ablf

 You can call me Betty wrote:
I just wonder how "expats" can be considered to be "contributing to the economy" of an area if they're largely retirees causing an increasing burden on healthcare and whilst their main contribution to the economy is spending a few quid occasionally in the local pizzeria and buying a baguette or three. They're not contributing a whole lot to society in their chosen place of residence.


Hmm, are you not confusing the poolside, wine swigging part-time idlers with full-time involved retired residentsI? I assume the statement was  a 'blague' for the benefit of we immigrants. I don't know where you hang your hat in France or what sort of company you keep but the immigrants I know and associate with have, over the years, pumped millions in to the French economy by way of taxation, investment and purchasing. As we are legally resident in France we are entitled to expect and receive the same standard of health care as the indigenous population and let those in charge ie. politicians sort out the finances of the present system.

A friend in need's a pest. Get rid.
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Re: This is one for ablf

Betty
I was not intending my posts to be a p155ing contest to prove one system is better than another, but to point out that there may be good reasons for the differences. Part of those differences may indeed be expectations and I personally agree about the dishing out of tablets plus tablets to counteract the negative effects of the first set of tablets, plus a third set of tablets to minimise the after effects of the second set, plus some paracetamol - which might have done the job in the first place, but which you cannot just buy for 16p per pack at the Supermarket as you can in the UK. [There is a debate there to be had as well. I personally think the UK is too lax in what can be obtained over the counter.]

To reinforce Cajal's post, UK pensioners are not a burden on the French system (by and large) the costs are paid for by the UK (assuming that is the state who issues their S1. Their use of the system is not (as far as I am aware) denying or delaying the treatment of French patients needing the same services.

What UK pensioners may well be is a burden on the UK system, for which they pay nothing, as do UK based pensioners. If there is a problem with the systems it is possibly that someone like me (and from your posts perhaps you) who has a good retirement income does not have to contribute to healthcare beyond my voluntary choice to take out mutuelle cover - just like any Frenchman or woman. That I pay that is entirely my choice, that I might be in a position where I have to pay that by choosing France as my place of residence is again my choice. I could have stayed in Germany and contributed 13% income for 100% cover. I could have returned to the UK, paid nothing and still received 100% cover.

Andy

A European Rahinja.
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Re: This is one for ablf

If I may chip in to this debate:-

'' To reinforce Cajal's post, UK pensioners are not a burden on the French system (by and large) the costs are paid for by the UK (assuming that is the state who issues their S1. Their use of the system is not (as far as I am aware) denying or delaying the treatment of French patients needing the same services. ''

My take on this is, in any area with a lot of UK retirees could the fact that the local medical services receive payment from the UK be a major contributory factor to those local medical services remaining viable. ie, without the UK payments there would be a case for closure of hospitals / clinics etc which would then adversely affect the local indigenous population.
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Re: This is one for ablf

Fair point !!

But also, I think I am correct in saying, that the health service is the biggest employer in Tours !!

Us young types would be adversely affected both economically and at a healthcare level if it was not for those old types creating employment and services.
ner ner nee ner ner!!
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Re: This is one for ablf

Oldies might just tip the balance between services staying or going but I am not sure they are a major factor.
Ticking over, just about.
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Re: This is one for ablf

As a poolside part-time idler (no wine swigging involved, I can't stand the stuff) I may be confusing the people I know with a wider, much more affluent population who work in France and have made social contributions, but I would struggle to imagine that the latter form a majority.
I am surprised that MY "huge bias with examples that prove nothing" is somehow more worthy of contempt than any "huge bias with examples that prove nothing " from someone sitting on the other side of the fence, but I'm happy to take that on the chin. As I said, we've ALL got examples and in general, nothing is what they do prove, as they can only, generally speaking, be based on personal experience.
Read through my other posts and you might notice that my "bias" has often extended to saying that I'm no particular fan of the NHS, but I remain unconvinced that the French health service is a better model.
I leave you with the thought that many, most, a large number of British pensioners living in France are quick to become righteously indignant if the mere threat of some reduction or withdrawal of their "rights" as pensioners is made. Winter fuel allowance, anyone? The principal argument being that "we've paid for this throughout our working lives and should be entitled to it". Or, if you live in the UK, there's the same group complaining in many areas that "you can't get a GP appointment for weeks, but all these immigrants just breeze in and get seen immediately".
Let's see if/when/whether the rosy-cheeked French peasants (a scary number of whom seemed to be on-side with the fragrant Marine) are less likely to start mumbling about "immigrants" in the coming years, as an ageing foreign population places increasing strain on their resources. And whether the current preferential treatment in the form of reciprocal healthcare agreements will survive Brexit unscathed.
But hey, I love the blinkered approach. Of course, if it wasn't for all these Brit immigrants, there would probably be massive redundancy in the French Health service. I mean, we're practically doing them a favour by moving to France to be ill.. As if.
Don't want to end up a cartoon in a cartoon graveyard.
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